[Shlomi of Vulcan]

No electronic prompter, no external notes, just a speech from the heart and mind of an 11 year old American.

[sevnson_71]

Shlomi of Vulcan, on 15 April 2010 - 11:57 PM, said:

No electronic prompter, no external notes, just a speech from the heart and mind of an 11 year old American.

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=MHieqM1hKsg

Impressed at her oratory skills, yes. Whether or not she is "America's hope" is going to depend upon how well she learns to practice independent thought and not just buy into the crap the people currently surrounding her are feeding her.

[Barbara]

Interesting S_71. The consensus here is: if she doesn't agree with me, she's being fed crap and she's not an independent thinker. Though at 11, I'm not so sure she could be an independent thinker. However, if she came out and said all the liberal jargon this site spues forth on a daily basis, she would be considered a genius. Why can't we as people be respectful of ALL opinions without labeling the ones we don't agree with as "crap".

[sevnson_71]

Not saying the Democrats don't have their healthy share as well(anyone who backreads at all in here knows I am NOT a fan of Madame Speaker or Hillary, to say nothing of some of the far left leaners any more than I am of far right conservatism. I am more advocating that as well as oratory skills, which don't get me wrong this kid's are tremendous, they should just as strongly be endowing kids her age with critical thinking skills to go with that tremendous ability to deliver a message so they can decide for themselves which is the path they want for the nation to take and why, and that the message they deliver is truly theirs and not merely a plagiarized page out of some strategist's handbook. Yes she is quite correct in the fact that our freedoms are in grave danger, but not so much from one political party's philosophy or another as to blind zealotry to that party's planks, which can be manipulated at will by a few people if the people in that party aren't paying attention. Then they just become cogs in a political machine instead of citizens exercising their rights to choose their nation's path. Trust me I saw many a person growing up vote "straight ticket" ballots before the practice was disallowed in our state. I asked them why they vote straight ticket and their reply was "because my parents voted that way". Not talking young people here, I am talking about older folks. They were also really upset over the inconvenience(their words, not mine) of that practice ending as well.

[ensign edwards]

Quote

However, if she came out and said all the liberal jargon this site spues forth on a daily basis, she would be considered a genius. Why can't we as people be respectful of ALL opinions without labeling the ones we don't agree with as "crap".

So, it's wrong to label opinions "crap" just because we disagree with them, but it is acceptable to label them "liberal jargon?" Do you not see a note of hypocrisy here?

[poko]

I have yet to find someone that young who wasn't spouting the opinions of those around her. Like the 'liberal' anti-war protester who got charged with truancy when her mom took her to the congressman's office during school hours. Her mom should be charged. Anyone who heard that girl talk knows she's just repeating stuff she heard from her parents.

This girl speaks a good line. Though she's hardly lived long enough to experience much of reality. I'll be more interested in her opinion when she's old enough to fight in our wars and pay her taxes, until then she's mostly drawing on other peoples experience.

Barbra, seems to me you agree but you protest that sevnson shares that opinion because you think it's a liberal attack. He made no mention of political sides, you did.

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

ensign edwards, on 17 April 2010 - 08:17 PM, said:

So, it's wrong to label opinions "crap" just because we disagree with them, but it is acceptable to label them "liberal jargon?" Do you not see a note of hypocrisy here?

That's what I saw too. I wish people would think about whether they show a consistent attitude before they hit that "post" button. But then maybe she is showing a consistency ... of sorts.

As I am almost certain that very few of you know or could care less about, Britain is facing a general election on May 6th. As I write my 18 year-old daughter is watching a recording of the Britian's first presidential-style debate between the three main party leaders. She's stoked to be able to vote in this election, and she's taken her responsibilities as a voter extremely seriously, in that she went to a husting last night and heard the three local MP candidates speak on national and local issues. She's going to be studying Politics along with International Studies at a Russell Group university in the Autumn and is most politically aware person of her age I know. She's appalled at any suggestion that the voting age should be lowered to 16. For all her inteligence and natural public speaking ability (and you'll just have to take my word on this), I very much doubt that even my daughter would have the ability and independence of thought to have genuinely known her politics at the age of 11. If you look closely enough at that little girl you can see the strings.

I'm just amazed that people have brought into this young girl's learned-by-rote pronouncements. But then she's only been programmed to appeal to the already converted. To the rest of us, what goes woof woof and wags it's cute li'l tail looks like the pup it is. Still it's funny to see Shlomi taking dictation from a pre-teen.

This post has been edited by JulesLuvsShinzon: 20 April 2010 - 09:41 AM

[Barbara]

ensign edwards, on 17 April 2010 - 08:17 PM, said:

So, it's wrong to label opinions "crap" just because we disagree with them, but it is acceptable to label them "liberal jargon?" Do you not see a note of hypocrisy here?

I do not, because one is not a insult, it actually defines a set of values.

Liberal - as in believing in more government control (i.e. wanting and believing that the new health care reform act is what we need), lacking moral restraint (don't need to convince you of that I'm sure), anti-Christianity (again, pretty obvious).
Jargon - as in the technical terminology used by or of a group.

The term Liberal Jargon is not hypocracy at all. It is a clear definition of a type of bantar that has been in several threads over many years. The majority of posters are liberal and they use terms that are typical of their beliefs. How can that be misconstrued? It would be akin to saying "nerd jargon" - one may not like being called a nerd, but if their behavior and words point them in that direction, they are one, whether they like it or not.

However, the word "crap" is a vulgar slang which is intended to insult. It means: foolish, deceitful, cheap, shoddy, insolent talk or behavior. There is nothing good implied in the use of that term at all.

@poko - I didn't read into it.

This post has been edited by Barbara: 20 April 2010 - 03:00 PM

[NMdum1]

I can get where the kid comes from, being a bit of a rebel when it comes to a lot of things intellectual. And I was pretty precocious myself at 11. I made a stand once at school at that age on why I was (and still am I) a passionate fan of the union which just about holds together the UK and why Scotland would probably never amount to much, if anything other than being an oversized habitat for sheep and a waste bin for everybody else without it, which was rather daring given the fact that I am a Scot, but I'm the sort of (very rare) person who normally describes themselves as 'British' first unless there is a good reason to get more specific than that. To be frank I have no words for how irresponsible and infintile and pathetic I think ethnic nationalists are in general.

As a European, and therefore somebody with a slightly more balanced view on the political spectrum than most people in a position to make huge amounts of noise on the subject (I'm looking at you Glenn Beck), I strongly dislike the insistence on using the word 'liberal' as a pejorative by many on the right in the US, demonstrating a lack of understanding about what the word liberal means. It seems to even be creeping into to Blue Dog Democrats and even the odd Democrat who wasn't against the war and that can only be a bad thing, particularly in the hands of somebody like Sean Hannity or the rest of the crew at FoxNews, what must surely be the least impartial broadcaster in the democratic world. I suggest anybody whose really petrified about the state of the wider intellectual life in America, get even more scared by reading an interesting book I picked up in my local library 'The Age of American Unreason - Dumbing Down and the Future of Democracy' by Susan Jacoby, covers all kinds of areas about the way that Americans think and respond to the world and really does pack a bit of a punch.

Incidentally JulesLuvsShinzon, I'm 27, I missed by 2 years the era-changing election of May 1997, I even missed the referendum over the Scottish Parliament by 1 year (I would have voted no-no, by the way - I missed the first elections to that dreadful establishment by 6 months), and remember well the trepedation of having to make such an awesome choice when I did get my time to choose even though it seemed obvious Mr Blair would win. Is your 18 year old just as stuck as I am? I swore I'd never vote Tory ever (I come from about 15 minutes up the road from Lockerbie and Mrs Thatcher had a lot to do with why we got hit as far as I'm concerned), and Cameron is as wet as anything, but given the dreadful pick of Cabinet Brown has and the fact that the Lib Dems are never going to form a government and in my area never be anything but a wasted vote, I'm really snookered.

This post has been edited by NMdum1: 20 April 2010 - 05:21 PM

[Shlomi of Vulcan]

JulesLuvsShinzon, on 20 April 2010 - 09:36 AM, said:

Still it's funny to see Shlomi taking dictation from a pre-teen.

A famous person, whom at the un-ripened age of 12 years old was said to have baffled the wisened elders of the cultural and spiritual center of his era with his common sense and wisdom, also stated as an adult that wisdom can come from the "mouth of babes". Is it possible that when he was 12 he was simply spouting the brainwashed philosophy of his right-winged parents from their backward rural community?

You, and those who think similarly, do not know this young girl, nor her level of intelligence and forethought to be able to make such generalized statements concerning her real convictions and understanding of the political and moral climate of this nation in this age.

[ensign edwards]

Quote

I do not, because one is not a insult, it actually defines a set of values.

Liberal - as in believing in more government control (i.e. wanting and believing that the new health care reform act is what we need), lacking moral restraint (don't need to convince you of that I'm sure), anti-Christianity (again, pretty obvious).
Jargon - as in the technical terminology used by or of a group.

Oh, come now. You can't define something as "lacking in moral restraint" (which I knew from context was what you meant, despite the fact that it has nothing to do with the actual definition of the word "liberal") and not mean it as an insult.

Quote

However, the word "crap" is a vulgar slang which is intended to insult. It means: foolish, deceitful, cheap, shoddy, insolent talk or behavior. There is nothing good implied in the use of that term at all.

There is nothing good in your definition of liberal.

[sevnson_71]

Barbara, on 20 April 2010 - 03:02 PM, said:

I do not, because one is not a insult, it actually defines a set of values.

Liberal - as in believing in more government control (i.e. wanting and believing that the new health care reform act is what we need), lacking moral restraint (don't need to convince you of that I'm sure), anti-Christianity (again, pretty obvious).
Jargon - as in the technical terminology used by or of a group.

The term Liberal Jargon is not hypocracy at all. It is a clear definition of a type of bantar that has been in several threads over many years. The majority of posters are liberal and they use terms that are typical of their beliefs. How can that be misconstrued? It would be akin to saying "nerd jargon" - one may not like being called a nerd, but if their behavior and words point them in that direction, they are one, whether they like it or not.

However, the word "crap" is a vulgar slang which is intended to insult. It means: foolish, deceitful, cheap, shoddy, insolent talk or behavior. There is nothing good implied in the use of that term at all.

@poko - I didn't read into it.

It is true, though I do believe myself to be one who believes in the teachings of Christ, I don't condone people of my faith or any other faith or sect shoving their beliefs down my throat or anyone elses' by rule of law. Secularist political views are not tantamount to anti-Christian. If anything they are more in line with Christ's teachings because they promote humanisn and retard religious discrimination(remember the Samaritan).


lib·er·al
   /ˈlɪbərəl, ˈlɪbrəl/ Show Spelled[lib-er-uhl, lib-ruhl] Show IPA –adjective 1. favorable to progress or reform, as in political or religious affairs. 2. ( often initial capital letter ) noting or pertaining to a political party advocating measures of progressive political reform. 3. of, pertaining to, based on, or advocating liberalism. 4. favorable to or in accord with concepts of maximum individual freedom possible, esp. as guaranteed by law and secured by governmentalprotection of civil liberties. 5. favoring or permitting freedom of action, esp. with respect to matters of personal belief or expression: a liberal policy toward dissident artistsand writers. 6. of or pertaining to representational forms of government rather than aristocracies and monarchies. 7. free from prejudice or bigotry; tolerant: a liberal attitude toward foreigners. 8. open-minded or tolerant, esp. free of or not bound by traditional or conventional ideas, values, etc. 9. characterized by generosity and willingness to give in large amounts: a liberal donor. 10. given freely or abundantly; generous: a liberal donation. 11. not strict or rigorous; free; not literal: a liberal interpretation of a rule. 12. of, pertaining to, or based on the liberal arts. 13. of, pertaining to, or befitting a freeman.
Dictionary.com

When you look at the textbook definition, it really isn't much of an insult. Truthfully it is really rather a large compliment. I guess it is a bit like scolding a dog; it isn't what you say but rather how you say it. Also one man's crap is another mans future flower garden. It all depends upon your perspective. But I digress...

What my objection is the use of a child however gifted she may be to tout an agenda without having given that child the full intellectual development to decide for herself if that is actually a good path. If this kid was a little older and I could be confident they actually knew the way the government works I could play ball and say " okay, I don't necessarily agree, but right on it's her choice." I truthfully do not believe IMHO that this is the case with this girl and call me a cynic but it would take quite a bit to change that opinion..

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

Barbara, on 20 April 2010 - 03:02 PM, said:

I do not, because one is not a insult, it actually defines a set of values.

Liberal - as in believing in more government control (i.e. wanting and believing that the new health care reform act is what we need), lacking moral restraint (don't need to convince you of that I'm sure), anti-Christianity (again, pretty obvious).

OK, you are a hypocrite! You don't call your personal assessment of Liberal values as an "insult"? What on earth do they teach you in your church? I recall you slamming me for dubbing something EE said over in one of the Nemesis threads as "an unforgiveably Christian point of view" because the tenure of his argument was unforgiving. YOU, came in and had a right go at me because you were "offended" and complained that I should be more aware of people who go to church and I basically told you where to get off because what I was posting was not directed at you and had nothing to do with you. NOW, you type out a load of ill-informed, ranting crap about Liberals in general and you seem not to care at all about how offensive your opinions are. If I were you I'd take some time to talk to a few Liberals and understand that you need to be very careful whom you accuse of "lacking moral restraint" and "anti-Christianity". Neither of those descriptors match me and I am certain tht EE - a person who has my utmost respect will not match them either. That's not Liberal "jargon" that's simply your prejudice.

Liberals aren't "anti-Christian" unless they're the kind of Christian who runs her mouth but doesn't back it up with action
(like tolerence for example) or the kind of Christian who demands that her beliefs take precedence over everyone else's, and then claims "descrimination" if that doesn't happen. At what point did you decide all by yourself that Liberals can't be Christians as well?

Time get your head out of that Bible and greet the real world.

Quote

The term Liberal Jargon is not hypocracy at all. It is a clear definition of a type of bantar that has been in several threads over many years. The majority of posters are liberal and they use terms that are typical of their beliefs. How can that be misconstrued? It would be akin to saying "nerd jargon" - one may not like being called a nerd, but if their behavior and words point them in that direction, they are one, whether they like it or not.

And where does YOUR behaviour point you?

And I don't know where you got the idea that the majority of posters here are Liberal - I got quite the opposite impression, or maybe it's just the Neo-Cons who run their mouths the loudest and the longest.

Quote

However, the word "crap" is a vulgar slang which is intended to insult. It means: foolish, deceitful, cheap, shoddy, insolent talk or behavior. There is nothing good implied in the use of that term at all.

Clearly not, and I'm sure Jesus is right up there in Heaven applauding you - NOT!

This post has been edited by JulesLuvsShinzon: 21 April 2010 - 08:07 AM

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

NMdum1, on 20 April 2010 - 05:15 PM, said:

Incidentally JulesLuvsShinzon, I'm 27, I missed by 2 years the era-changing election of May 1997, I even missed the referendum over the Scottish Parliament by 1 year (I would have voted no-no, by the way - I missed the first elections to that dreadful establishment by 6 months), and remember well the trepedation of having to make such an awesome choice when I did get my time to choose even though it seemed obvious Mr Blair would win. Is your 18 year old just as stuck as I am? I swore I'd never vote Tory ever (I come from about 15 minutes up the road from Lockerbie and Mrs Thatcher had a lot to do with why we got hit as far as I'm concerned), and Cameron is as wet as anything, but given the dreadful pick of Cabinet Brown has and the fact that the Lib Dems are never going to form a government and in my area never be anything but a wasted vote, I'm really snookered.

I feel your pain because there's not an awful lot of difference between the three parties since New Labour moved in on a lot of traditional Tory policy areas. Here in Bath, we've had a Lib Dem MP for at least 3 terms and he's been a good, hardworking MP with sensible values. A Labour vote where I live is definitely seen as a "wasted" vote. However, even though Nick Clegg made the best showing in the leaders' debate, I still don't that there's any real substance behind the policies. I think the Trident issue will also prove to be a deal-breaker for many voters given that even people like me who would love to see the back of nukes don't see now as being the time for a unilateral move. My daughter is, I think, already quite sure whom she will vote for. She went to a local meeting the candidates of the three main parties held for young people and I think that helped her consolidate her opinion. However, her comment was that political parties should get people into schools to speak directly to 6th formers. So far, the ocal Tory candidate is the only person who has contacted her directly as a result of her turning 18. A bit of a missed opportunity I think!

This post has been edited by JulesLuvsShinzon: 21 April 2010 - 08:18 AM

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

Shlomi of Vulcan, on 20 April 2010 - 05:16 PM, said:

A famous person, whom at the un-ripened age of 12 years old was said to have baffled the wisened elders of the cultural and spiritual center of his era with his common sense and wisdom, also stated as an adult that wisdom can come from the "mouth of babes". Is it possible that when he was 12 he was simply spouting the brainwashed philosophy of his right-winged parents from their backward rural community?

Absolutely, and given the remarks posted about that clippage, a lot of people have suggested that she is probably homeschooled. No disrespect for the young lady's public speaking ability, but those she's definitely been schooled about a certain view of American history by her parents, church, or school. How could she not? From whom do children receive their learning? This is a bright, personable child who no doubt will have a GREAT future in the Republican Party, but she is not some wunderkind in receipt of divine wisdom. I've known children wise beyond their years, but they tend not to be political opinions of the kind expressed in that clip or in that way. Put it this way, if I heard an equally bright 11 year-old spouting opinions and views that I as a Liberal hold dear (such as pro-choice, gay marriage, proper race and sex equality etc), I wouldn't for a moment believe that that child hadn't absorbed the teachings of her parents. I raised my daughter a Liberal, darn right, it's what we parents do, and it doesn't make the words spoken by an 11 year-old something miraculous. Let's hope she gets to a decent university and becomes exposed to a less narrow view of the world.

Quote

You, and those who think similarly, do not know this young girl, nor her level of intelligence and forethought to be able to make such generalized statements concerning her real convictions and understanding of the political and moral climate of this nation in this age.

But the point is Shlomi, neither do you know her and are therefore in no position to venerate this kid while we point ut the likely reality behind the pageant (and I use the word advisedly). She's a very good actress that's all - as all budding young politicians need to be. I have a daughter who does public speaking so I know how they are groomed to perform in that way. Too bad you fell for it. Don't complain; you put posted the linky up here, you must have known people would respond.

[Shlomi of Vulcan]

JulesLuvsShinzon, on 21 April 2010 - 08:31 AM, said:

Absolutely, and given the remarks posted about that clippage, a lot of people have suggested that she is probably homeschooled. No disrespect for the young lady's public speaking ability, but those she's definitely been schooled about a certain view of American history by her parents, church, or school. How could she not? From whom do children receive their learning? This is a bright, personable child who no doubt will have a GREAT future in the Republican Party, but she is not some wunderkind in receipt of divine wisdom. I've known children wise beyond their years, but they tend not to be political opinions of the kind expressed in that clip or in that way. Put it this way, if I heard an equally bright 11 year-old spouting opinions and views that I as a Liberal hold dear (such as pro-choice, gay marriage, proper race and sex equality etc), I wouldn't for a moment believe that that child hadn't absorbed the teachings of her parents. I raised my daughter a Liberal, darn right, it's what we parents do, and it doesn't make the words spoken by an 11 year-old something miraculous. Let's hope she gets to a decent university and becomes exposed to a less narrow view of the world.

But the point is Shlomi, neither do you know her and are therefore in no position to venerate this kid while we point ut the likely reality behind the pageant (and I use the word advisedly). She's a very good actress that's all - as all budding young politicians need to be. I have a daughter who does public speaking so I know how they are groomed to perform in that way. Too bad you fell for it. Don't complain; you put posted the linky up here, you must have known people would respond.

Haven't a clue if this child is homeschooled, private schooled or public schooled. It really doesn't matter except in one regard, whichever brand of educational training she is receiving (at home, in the classroom, her place of worship - if she has one -, or the playground) is helping to shape her thinking (as it has done with all of us). And, whether or not she is a "wunderkind in receipt of divine wisdom," while not likely, still remains to be seen. Of course, common sense would indicate that there are very likely 11 year olds with a more leftist view of life that can articulate that view with equal clarity and would also make for fine additions to the DEMOCRATIC Party at some future date, or at least one more warm body on the silver screen of Hollywood.

"Too bad I fell for it"? You mean like 53% of the American population who fell for Obama's line of public speaking hook-line-and-sinker during his campaign, where crowds were literally in tears over some of his flowing BS rhetoric? He too is a fine actor and deserved an Oscar much more than an unearned Nobel Peace Prize.

And, of course I knew people would respond. You must think me some kind of idiot not to expect counter ideas and even negative ones. This is a Political Discussion thread afterall, and the of the main reasons I do post is to get those other ideas expressed from the various camps. Who said I was complaining, expect possibly you in your above response.

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

Shlomi of Vulcan, on 21 April 2010 - 12:36 PM, said:

Haven't a clue if this child is homeschooled, private schooled or public schooled. It really doesn't matter except in one regard, whichever brand of educational training she is receiving (at home, in the classroom, her place of worship - if she has one -, or the playground) is helping to shape her thinking (as it has done with all of us). And, whether or not she is a "wunderkind in receipt of divine wisdom," while not likely, still remains to be seen. Of course, common sense would indicate that there are very likely 11 year olds with a more leftist view of life that can articulate that view with equal clarity and would also make for fine additions to the DEMOCRATIC Party at some future date, or at least one more warm body on the silver screen of Hollywood.

What you mean there are no Republican movie stars? I know it seems to be recieved "wisdom" in right wing circles that Hollywood is a seething Babylon of moral decline, but from where I'm sitting, Hollywood looks pretty conservative to me. How come there are still no gay people in Star Trek for example?

I can absolutely guarantee that there are 11 year-olds who could deliver a speech espousing Liberal values just as well, if not a whole lot more convinvingly, than this young lady. I think I at least intimated that to be the case in my last post. Wunderkind pageants have me reaching for the puke bucket whatever political complexion they happen to be.

To be a Liberal is more than just a matter of indoctrination - hopefully that's the case with the Neo-Cons too - because at some point kids grow up and see their parents have feet of clay. When they see the world through their own eyes and not just hear the talk around the dinner table between adults, then they have to make their own minds up. Liken it, if you will, as being like a Christian baptism and then confirmation. My daughter's a Liberal now because her parents are, but will she change when she gets to university and meets people with different views? Will she retain them into her forties?

I should know, I used to be Tory - Girl!

Quote

"Too bad I fell for it"? You mean like 53% of the American population who fell for Obama's line of public speaking hook-line-and-sinker during his campaign, where crowds were literally in tears over some of his flowing BS rhetoric? He too is a fine actor and deserved an Oscar much more than an unearned Nobel Peace Prize.

Well, given the preceeding success of Bush and his inability to string a coherent sentence together, then I'm not suprised that people fell about weeping - probably from relief that in Obama they finally have a guy who looks and acts like he's got a brain in is head and not a 30-watt light bulb, and one whom the rest of the world don't regard as an utter clown.

As for his Nobel Prize and has he earned it yet? No, I will agree with you there, but it's amazing how a relieved rest of the world over-reacts now that Dubya isn't fumbling with the nuclear button.

Quote

And, of course I knew people would respond. You must think me some kind of idiot not to expect counter ideas and even negative ones. This is a Political Discussion thread afterall, and the of the main reasons I do post is to get those other ideas expressed from the various camps. Who said I was complaining, expect possibly you in your above response.

Oh, I don't think you're an idiot Shlomi, I just think you like to argue with people and here is one of the places you like to do it. But if you want to here those opinions from other camps, you'll need to suck 'em up!

This post has been edited by JulesLuvsShinzon: 21 April 2010 - 12:56 PM

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

NMdum1, on 20 April 2010 - 05:15 PM, said:

I can get where the kid comes from, being a bit of a rebel when it comes to a lot of things intellectual. And I was pretty precocious myself at 11. I made a stand once at school at that age on why I was (and still am I) a passionate fan of the union which just about holds together the UK and why Scotland would probably never amount to much, if anything other than being an oversized habitat for sheep and a waste bin for everybody else without it, which was rather daring given the fact that I am a Scot, but I'm the sort of (very rare) person who normally describes themselves as 'British' first unless there is a good reason to get more specific than that. To be frank I have no words for how irresponsible and infintile and pathetic I think ethnic nationalists are in general.

I didn't respond to this earlier, but I wanted to say that I'm glad to see another smart poster joining our ranks. I have no time for ethnic nationalists either, and that's not just because I'm English, but because I don't see totally devolved governments working in such a small country. If you take it to it's logical conclusion, one day we'll need passports to go to Scotland or Wales (my antecendents were from the Rhondda - so I'll pass on Wales thanks!).

When I was 14, I gave a very impassioned defence of Pro-Choice in an RE lesson of all places. I know I didn't get that stance from my parents, but it's something I've always believed in. It was pretty good actually, good enough to rile the RE teacher into losing her temper because she couldn't cope with a well-reasoned argument for something she was opposed to.

This post has been edited by JulesLuvsShinzon: 21 April 2010 - 01:02 PM